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Intro to Singapore’s Socio-Political Blogosphere

Posted by intellisg on July 17, 2007

theorycast.26 :: Intro to Singapore’s Socio-Political Blogosphere
Show Guest: Bernard Leong • Location: Geek Terminal • Show Length: 20min

Bernard Leong of SingaporeAngle shows us how we can get involved in
Singapore’s socio-political blogosphere. If you notice the markers on
the video timeline, those indicate additional comments and clickable
links to things we mentioned in the interview.

There’s also a link to a directory of socio-political bloggers
compiled by my social media students earlier this year. Their
assignment involved each of them “adopting a local political blogger”.

See http://theory.isthereason.com/?p=1761

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97 Responses to “Intro to Singapore’s Socio-Political Blogosphere”

  1. sumiko said

    hahahaha not one single mention abt the ultra secretive brotherhood. There you go. hahahahahaha.

  2. Aurora said

    Sista,

    Trust me, they don’t need it / wherever they go, they just bag it all.

    Happy Reading.

    Aurora

  3. Kevin said

    Secret brotherhood? Hmm, we’ll have to add that to the directory. 😛

  4. chief editor said

    Omitting mention of the brotherhood press in the Singapore blogosphere is a bit like attempting to compile an encyclopedia of all the species in the animal kingdom and missing out the primates. It makes for happy delusional reading which goes well with laughing gas, but hardly adds any value to capturing the reality of a descriptive ecology, not when you consider, they probably have the largest segment of the socio – political read fest. Where did all the bananas go, I wonder?

  5. Tracy said

    Why wasn’t the Brotherhood Press even given a mentioned? I think we can more or less treat this analysis as incomplete and perhaps even lacking in professional and objective standing.

    (I have made a similar post in the Singapore Angle and I hope to get a reply)

  6. Confused said

    sumiko: hahahaha not one single mention abt the ultra secretive brotherhood.

    Chief Editor: Omitting mention of the brotherhood press in the Singapore blogosphere is a bit like attempting to compile an encyclopedia of all the species in the animal kingdom and missing out the primates.

    I’m confused: so is it “ultra secretive” or so prominent as the primates are in the animal kingdom? Presumably the more apt comparison would be a secretive animal such as the dormouse.

    Either way, it is rather criminal of Bernard to compile his encyclopedia without mentioning those cute critters.

  7. darkness said

    No need, this way, we know where we stand with the rest of singapore of blogosphere.

    Harphoon, I want our diplomatic mission in Singapore to be cancelled.

    We know where we stand, we do not need a reply.

    We will come, see and conquer and that will be all, thank you.

    This is war

  8. Harphoon said

    By your command.

  9. chronicler said

    You want to eliminate from the history, then you cannot blame us, if we write you off from the face of the planet – tell all your writers – prepare for war.

    This was unwarranted, as it is provocative.

  10. chronicler said

    It is best if you treat us as dead and continue to ignore us – we will prevail as always. It will make no difference as our leader has mentioned,

    “we will come, see and conquer!”

    Long live the brotherhood!

  11. chronicler said

    Not even a single mention – that is a spit in both our writers and readers face. You will learn the meaning of loss, like all our enemies.

    This will be our last transmission. From this moment onwards, expect us to trash everything you produce.

    Remember you started this, not us!

  12. Harphoon said

    I am usually a moderate, but this can only be atrributable to a few reasons, one stupidly, negligent oversight or plain marginalization.

    As much as I would like to give the benefit of the doubt – I move for war as well.

  13. Harphoon said

    There is no possible excuse to erase our history – we have worked hard to earn a place – we have no choice but to fight.

    Anyone of their writers who produces within a period of one month can expect a pointed and terse response from us – it will be sharp and to the point, to accomplish only one objective – to discredit and render inconsequential and irrelevant / we will even roll out our reserve writers.

    I really cannot understand how this could have happened without at least a deliberate and malicious intent.

    It remains incomprehensible to me. Why they made these calculations, it is disrespectful and an insult of the highest order and if we do not respond accordingly, we will lose – we have no choice but to destroy them.

    As a moderate. I consider this sad.

    You have my support chronicler.

  14. Harphoon said

    I would seriously recommend all our old and new readers to view the pod cast and draw their respective conclusions.

    You decide whether we are unreasonable.

    But pls remember this we did not start this war, it was brought to our doorstep in the most malicious and derisive manner.

  15. inspir3d said

    what the hell is going on? you guys are nuts. have you even given thought to the fact u are partnered with the IS umbrella, which was mentioned more than once in the video?

    if you make enemies with my friends, u will soon make yourselves a liability, and that would indeed be sad given our arrangement

    i think, you should just keep your wars to your space-games and out of the blogosphere.

    i warn you, if you go cyber squatting at singapore angle, our partnership is finished.

  16. Nacramanga said

    Then let is be finished

  17. Nacramanga said

    You do not compile a list of sites by omitting whole sale the brotherhood press.

    We research.

    We produce regularly fyi 5.6 times more than the average blogger out there.

    We garner more than 78.4% of the socio/ political readership in Singapore.

    Add that to our SLF we probably have all of them in our pocket.

    We crew our production to run rain and shine / work is not an excuse / time is even less of an excuse / it runs like a factory.

    So why were we marginalized to such a degree and extent.

    You mean to say, you understand that.

    You want to threaten us Inspir3d, just end it right here, you have the power, this is not the first time we can gone through this, it will not be the last either, all we are asking is was there a systematic process of marginalization undertaken by a project to catalog a list of sites in the singapore blogsphere? You have no idea how many of our readers are asking this question as well.

    A simple question that deserves a simple answer.

    I ask you again is it finished – the decision is yours, it lies in the palm of your hands.

    We want answers!

    FYI a state of war exist!

    Give us the answer bfr 1300 hr local sing time, we will take it from there.

    Nacramanga

    Commander of the 130th Sardo-khan division of the brotherhood.

  18. inspir3d said

    Nacramanga, who do you think you are?

    with your impulsive tongue you insult harphoon’s hard work of the last six months, denigrate the efforts of such people as Astroboy, Scholarboy, Aurora, and even Darkness.

    i have dealt with the b’hood long enough to know that your hot headed comments are representative of you, yourself and only yourself.

    you want an answer? then gather with harphoon, darkness and the chronicler and meet me in person. we can sort this out face to face, rather than behind computer screens and with keyboards.

  19. Harphoon said

    Inspirid

    Even darkness has been out voted on this issue – he has been trying to calm the others down, but even he is overcome – he is simply a spokesman.

    As you know inspirid. I have always been a moderate and pacifist, but this degree of marginalization is too flagrant to tolerate so we will have to stick to our guns / it is a matter of principle.

    If Aurora’s article doesnt run by 0900 am tomorrow, pls consider our collaboration terminated.

    You have no idea how much I will regret this, but some things we must fight preserve at all cost such as our history.

    I am very sorry by friend, tmr I will log on at 0900 am, if it isnt there consider this a good bye message.

    Your friend and your sincerly as you very know.

    Harphoon.

  20. scholarboy said

    Inspirid,

    Nacramanga speaks for all of us. We all know he is a fool, but when we have a common enemy, we all put aside our differences and close ranks and a we speak as one.

    Think, this is madness, but there is politics here that is beyond even you or me, even darkness knows when wolfs howl, it is best for tigers to sheet his claws.

    This matter has hit a raw nerve – the erasement of our history.

    We all speak in one voice -our position is clear – you will have to decide my friend. Frankly speaking, both I and AB work well with you so I will be very sad if this comes to an end, but it has been decided.

    I am sorry, let tmr decide – we shall all see, if Aurora’s article runs at 9.00 am, you will simply have to stand in line like the rest of us, if it doesn’t we will have to say good bye – as harphoon said, it is a matter of principle.

    Always remember this is politics.

    Yours very respectfully

    Scholarboy

  21. inspir3d said

    harphoon,

    with or without this request, Aurora’s article is already on the way.

    you guys seem to have elevated Bernard to the point where everything he says is gospel. why do you take one man’s comments as representative of the entire blogosphere? does a single individual wield such power over the Brotherhood’s pride?

    if you only knew him personally as i do you would know an insult would be the furthest thing from his mind.

    but of course your brotherhood has elected to remain detached from the rest of the blogosphere; even i, having made multiple requests to meet your members in person have been met with postponements and non replies.

    is it any wonder, then, that in the absence of any sort of quality communication, the only times we really have serious exchanges is when we are getting into heated arguments?

    Aurora’s article will run. Just like the hundred other articles that have run before that.

    And in return, i only request a real life audience with the individuals i know only by pseudonyms, through emails, and their essays.

    Surely that is not too much to ask.

  22. inspir3d said

    Brotherhood,

    I am organising a small gathering at dinner time on Friday 27th July.

    Aaron Ng, Christopher Ng, and some bloggers from Singapore Angle, including Bernard himself, will be there.

    Send a representative. Ask all the questions you want.

    I will email the exact details to Aurora.

  23. inspir3d said

    And for goodness sake. Don’t bail out this time.

  24. inspir3d said

    oh yes, one more thing. this event does not replace my meetings with the ICG and the FC Boys.

  25. Christopher Ng said

    All,

    Wow it would indeed be interesting to meet the brotherhood. I’ve been playing D&D for 20 years and I want to know what kind of game you guys are playing ( I don’t mean it in a double-meaning sort of way. ).

    I did attempt to publish some d20 material at Lulu before but it did not sell any copies at all.

    Regards

  26. Timid said

    I saw this bit on Kevin’s (Theory is the Reason) post:

    This directory was shared publicly on this blog, where bloggers such as Bernard filled in the missing pieces. You can view the directory here, and if you wish to contribute to it, please drop a comment here for an invite.

    I think that the brotherhood could educate the public by filling in the gaps directly and not depend on people such as Bernard, who obviously doesn’t know much about them anyway.

  27. […] Leong’s afterword on the Singapore Angle, as well as the discussions on Singabloodypore and Intelligent Singaporean. Some prominent blogs were missed in our short video and will being noted via the spreadsheet. […]

  28. Nacramanga said

    Dowan to eat with u la, a state of war exist fool, good try to poison us all.

  29. Nacramanga said

    “I think that the brotherhood could educate the public by filling in the gaps directly and not depend on people such as Bernard, who obviously doesn’t know much about them anyway.”

    Sure la. This is like saying if you study the history of Germany, you didnt mistook the Nazi party as a public holiday or adolf hitler as father Xmas.

    Ask him to go and get a new brain – a state of war exist, we are not filling in anything.

    We are obvious dealing with an idiot og mega proportions.

  30. Azmodeus said

    “You want to eliminate from the history, then you cannot blame us, if we write you off from the face of the planet – tell all your writers – prepare for war.

    This was unwarranted, as it is provocative.”

    And I wonder which is more provocative, the person crying for war and elimination, or the one not putting you on their list.

    *smiles* bravo bravo

  31. The Singapore Tattler said

    Good Morning,

    I would like to say, this is my first time posting. Usually I read only. However, I have been an avid follower of the BP and IS. I also happen to know the history of the brotherhood very well going back all the way to the famed icered.com days.

    As I understand it, history is very important to these guys. Many years ago, they fought one of the biggest wars in cyber space which ran into millions in real monetary terms with a white power virtual army. Their reason, these gamers were scrubbing out all records of their existence.

    They are so paranoid abt ppl tampering with their history, they even regularly launch sleeper ships into cyberspace, these are like repositories and data banks which do nothing except float around.

    They also keep very detailed records and have such a thing as the book of ages which is wholly managed by the chronicler.

    All this is done only for one purpose to preserve their history. Generally, you can call them names etc or even threaten them, they will take it lightly, but once someone mucks with their history by distorting, altering and representing a version of history which is wholly inaccurate and skewered.

    You are really asking for serious trouble. Personally, I dont want to get involved in this melee btw them and B.Leong. However, even I cannot understand how someone who claims to have researched as he mentioned the “major” socio / political generators in blogosphere can do all this without even so much as once mentioning even the brotherhood press.

    I really dont think, claiming not to know much abt them is an excuse. We can all have differing opinions, but there is no excuse not to know the facts.

    To be very honest with you as much as I like to believe it may have been an innocent oversight or a lapse by Bernard. I sincerely doubt it.

    After all as much as I hate to say this, they command a significant number of readers, so whether we like it or not, they are definitely here to stay. So really I for one cannot understand why they were not even given a cursory mention by BL – this remains the most disturbing point.

    However, I do not believe the brotherhood should take such a militant stance to this development. For some reason they seem to confuse blogosphere with the games they all play. All this invasion and seige machine talk will serve only to alienate them further from the rest of blogosphere.

    I for one and very sad to see that a state of war has been declared, knowing darkness, he will go all the way, so there can be only one winner.

    I am very sorry for this long post. I only wish to say, I hope rationality will return.

    GKH

  32. prof Small Timer said

    “And I wonder which is more provocative, the person crying for war and elimination, or the one not putting you on their list.”

    I think if the list was represented as a personal take by BL, there would be no issue. But in this case, it is very clear for all to see, pls review the vid, it is very clear the producers made it very clear this was a ‘comprehensive’ list and as he mentioned ‘research’ material – and when you use such references, you just need to be objective, that means you have forfeited your right to exclude or for that matter include anything other than what the facts demand of you.

    Personally, I dont blame BL but rather the people who run the IS, they should have made the situation clear, but instead remained silent and that is the bizzare part, really its as good as leaving the door to allow the dogs out.

  33. easyrider said

    “I think that the brotherhood could educate the public by filling in the gaps directly and not depend on people such as Bernard, who obviously doesn’t know much about them anyway.”

    If he doesnt “know much abt them,” then what kind of rubbish was he compiling. If you dont believe me, you could even sit down with any tin pot academic and the first turn of the question would be methodology. So saying he “obviously doesnt know much abt them” he has more or less shot himself in the foot.

  34. Still Confused said

    Did a bit more reading and now even more confused. According to this interview between J. Kompf and Darkness, I thought the b’hood is not really into the socio-political blogging scene (someone called it the “plogosphere”; ugly name) at all? Some bits from the interview:

    What you need to understand is: the brotherhood does not set either our political orientation (not that we ever had one in the first place) or for that matter, the final form of it’s content. The final arbiter is always the customer. We are more market driven than you can possibly imagine…

    The facts are simply this: Most of our readers do not wish to read the regular diet of anti establishment content which are typically generated by the vast majority of Singaporean blogs… all our market research indicates our readers do not fall into this category. Besides this market segment is already saturated, so it offers little in the way of a healthy return on energy. I really don’t see the point.

    Most our readers are fatigued, tired and simply want an alternative besides the staid end of the spectrum read provided by either the mainstream media or blogosphere – I can give you plenty of illustrations to empirically prove this. Both our travelogue and stories for example continue to score significant hits…

    …we produce the travelogue because they are popular, but bear in mind their popularity differs considerably from socio-political blogs. In the case of the latter, readers will log in and more or less chew it up in a few days, but for travelogues, what we often observe the long tail effect – that’s to say many of the readers will read them even after months! So this ‘demand or pull trend’ ( for lack of a better word) challenges the whole definition of what is considered ‘good’ or ‘popular’ content. For example, if a socio-political article scores X number of hits in 24 hours flat. Does it mean it is more popular than a travelogue that achieves the same number of hits in 2 months? This is really something to consider: because in these two comparisons. I can argue, the readership profile, motivation and demand experienced is so diverse and different, it may not even be an apple to apple comparison. This illustrates what I call the ‘paradox of readership’ – it is at the end of the day self selecting] But that is another topic that is best left to another forum…

    The brotherhood recognizes this and much of the content we offer today is based exactly on his technosocialogical development in blogosphere.

  35. As It Is! said

    If it had been blatantly proclaimed that it was a “Comprehensive List” that Bernard Leong has “researched” but well-known and well-read sites like the Brotherhood Press have been left out, then the research job must have been a wishy-washy effort of someone who “doesn’t know much”.

    I am quite sure that before they released the list they must have checked and counter-checked and counter-counter-checked again and again to ensure that the list is really and truly a “COMPREHENSIVE” one. If not, then it is their credibility that is at stake and not that of the Brotherhood nor others whom they could have left out, deliberately or otherwise.

    So, as I see it, there is no need for an all-out war. All that is needed is for the IS to produce another comprehensive list, which should be more accurate and all-inclusive, to give a real slap on Bernard & company’s face. Then, this list would supercede what the Singapore Angle or Bernard has produced and it would serve as a reference in the future.

    However, if a war it has to be, then I would no doubt fully support it to the last drop of blood, though very sad, for it is a just and reasonable course to right what is wrong.

    I remain yours always:

    AS IT IS!

  36. Nacramanga said

    “oh yes, one more thing. this event does not replace my meetings with the ICG and the FC Boys.”

    Under the terms of the Irrulian Space Federation Protocal under section 2(4) / a declaration of war is preceeded by the setting up of a provisional junta overseened by the spacing council.

    The FC boys are no longer in charge / our diplomatic mission has been terminated and the role of Pre-Science officers is defunct.

    The management of future relationships with the rest of blogosphere will be governed by the Provisional Defence Spacing Council which I head.

    This is now a matter for the Space Self Defence Division of the brotherhood – the 130th.

    We do not fratenize with the enemy.

  37. Nacramanga said

    And dont go off running to darkness like a cry baby, even he cant help himself, let alone you, you ppl never gave him a chance, he has been out voted on this issue by a landslide as for his great charisma, you should have seen how they all boooed him.

    You ppl went too far this time – any attempt to erase our history can never be tolerated or countenanced!

    Aurora find KOHO, I dont want to deal with you (nothing personal), ask him to activate silent no bubble channel com / switch over to encrypt for all our com-sat.

    off-line

  38. shoestring said

    The BP is the first to come to mind whenever I wish to read socio-political articles. What sets their articles apart from the rest is the philosophical tinge. They seldom comment directly on any socio-political issue but take a holistic/generic approach that sets you thinking about principles that are “transferable” across different issues. They allow you to make up your own mind.

    Those blogs mentioned by BL are more “current” and focused on particular issues as and when they arise. Therefore they can be easily identified as socio-political blogs. They are also easier to read and understand. And usually, they write to win you to their side.

    Judging from the title of the videocast (Intro to Singapore’s Socio-Political Blogosphere), it is just a teaser, much like what you would expect from the “Idiot” series of books such as “Blogging for Idiots” (no offence intended). The BP is in my opinion, above that league. It’s more esoteric and academic. So perhaps the Brotherhood could take that ommission as a compliment instead of an insult. Think “For advanced ready only.”

    In fact, some of the sites BL recommended, I would not because they can be extremely biased or “drama” on certain issues. Not to mention double standards and occasional distortion. Also, Mr Wang seemed to have moved on from the socio-political to things more “spiritual” lately. So, we could take BL’s recommendations as his personal preferences rather than an objective comprehensive list. This is evidenced in the fact that he did not recommend TOC and similar blogs because he apparently preferred to remain neutral.

    I hope I did not offend anyone. If so, my apologies.

  39. inspir3d said

    “And dont go off running to darkness like a cry baby, even he cant help himself, let alone you, you ppl never gave him a chance, he has been out voted on this issue by a landslide as for his great charisma, you should have seen how they all boooed him.

    You ppl went too far this time – any attempt to erase our history can never be tolerated or countenanced!”

    Nacramanga.

    are you man enough to meet me in the flesh? or will u just hide behind your computer and your keyboard and keep on typing threats?

    If Darkness has been voted out, then keep him out. We’ll keep this issue between you and me, although with your impetuous temperament i should be careful that you might engage in physical assault.

    i think this ‘attempt to erase your history’ is but a figment of your own imagination; “You ppl” does not exist. i come online to publish Aurora’s article only to see a crazy reaction to what is a non-event.

    the FC boys have been doing all the work here; the ICG have also contributed to the BP here; in comparison i have no idea what the 130th is or does…

    perhaps it is time for your “Space Self Defence Division” to actually do something constructive rather than just make trouble.

  40. inspir3d said

    harphoon, astroboy, scholarboy and darkness have been hard at work building this franchise here. i will not let their efforts be dismantled overnight by a hot-headed madman.

  41. inspir3d said

    i tell you something Nacramanga,

    even if you chaps pack up and leave, the last six months spent here on IS will be an uneraseable part of your history.

    you go and search on the net for all your previous partnerships e.g. icered; they have all disappeared.

    but IS will be here for years, even decades to come. i guarantee you that.

    You can destroy this partnership. But you cannot destroy your history.

    i may not be of the brotherhood. but for better or worse our fates have become intertwined. i tell you, nobody is going to support the brotherhood press like i have in the past 6 months. when you guys were floating around and busy getting kicked out of other ppls blogs, I was the one who took the risk and supported you and took criticism and flack for publishing your stuff.

    Nobody else here on the Singapore blogosphere is going to spend as much time and effort as I have putting up your writings for the world to see.

    Again I say, you can destroy this partnership. But you cannot destroy your history.

  42. Aurora said

    This is com-sat Transmission from Sardonyx sector in the Tiriana sector / Mailer: Scholar boy / to: Inspir3d.

    Hello Inspir3d,

    This matter concerning BL’s vid has been politicized beyond reason. Whenever issues of erasing our history crops up, it opens painful memories for many of us. The brotherhood fought two wars in the virtual, Pillium and the Ascension because of this reason alone. Wars that involved the gaming community in nearly 45 countries that amounted to millions, it is impossible to explain to people who do not know what gaming is all about what this means, let me just say even if a bridge is destroyed in the virtual, someone once put a line to it, designed it, textured it and spent maybe hundreds of hours to build it, so what is real and what is false?

    The issue of erasing our history will always be a contentious issue. Hence the paranoia, let things cool down, darkness is no fool, he knows this is not the time to take on the council, old wounds have been reopened there is too much pain from our past coloring the debate. Even today many of us scour the infinity of cyberspace reclaiming what was once indiscriminately deleted, slowly piecing back fragments of our fragile past, so you see this is a very serious matter to all of us without exception and when others callously choose to omit or gloss over events without regard to the truth, it is bound to revive the ghost of the past. Darkness knows this only too well, he must have, he fought in both wars, so even he knows this is not the time. For the time just ignore people like nacramanga and JDAM, they are just hot air, none of the intellectuals in the brotherhood even listens to them, they are only good for you shot me and I shot you games, that’s their forte, but if you fight with him, you will make our task of quiet diplomacy difficult.

    As for darkness he is an old hand, this is not the first time he has been voted out, he knows in life a man must learn to pick and choose his battles and there is a time to let things happen and a time to make it happen. When the time and conditions present themselves he will make his move. He has been discredited because many perceive his attempts have to secure lasting peace with the Tirianians in the Kilmaron system has resulted in another costly protracted war, it was a serious diplomatic miscalculation that will have far reaching economic repercussions much of which has been used by his enemies in the senate to vote him out.

    Give it time and be calm Inspir3d – the brotherhood press is still producing, articles will still be churned out, nothing on the surface has changed, but this entire matter of BL’s post has caused great disharmony, like I said it is politics and it will too will past and hopefully reason will prevail again. So remain calm.

    Yours Sincerely

    Scholarboy

    2nd Class Pre-Science Officer Federation Space Diplomatic Corps

  43. inspir3d said

    Scholarboy,

    it is good to hear a voice of reason.

    i trust your group will gather yourselves and sense will prevail.

    the invitation for the coming friday is still open. i hope one or two of you will attend.

    insp.

  44. gigi said

    I think we can more or less use this ‘comprehensive’ list to line our bird cages.

    I for one cannot understand how anyone and it doesnt really matter whether it is an objective or subjective analysis can fail to mention the brotherhood press when it comes to sociol /political write ups in Singapore.

    I am starting to even question the rest of the “analysis” – if they can get the fundamentals so wrong, what else did they miss out on?

    Worse still they dont even bother to correct it or issue out a response, if this is not spitting in the face of the truth, I dont know what is.

    No wonder those space boys are so pissed off. Its like saying Francis Raffles never ever existed and Singapore was build by an alien race from outer space.

  45. scholarboy said

    Dear Readers,

    The only sensible post is in this thread is from – (5) above.

    “Tracy Says:

    July 19th, 2007 at 1:00 pm
    Why wasn’t the Brotherhood Press even given a mentioned? I think we can more or less treat this analysis as incomplete and perhaps even lacking in professional and objective standing.

    (I have made a similar post in the Singapore Angle and I hope to get a reply)”

    A state of war exist – and I am an officer who reports directly to the space federation / so the possibility of an official or informal dialogue with him is completely out of the question.

    Perhaps Miss Tracy can serve as a proxy to answer many of our readers questions.

    Having said that, I really do not think its wise for Mr Bernard Leong to issue out any reply, they the council have lined up their best scholars.

    Trust me, if you think darkness is good, multiply it by roughly 3.5 times, that’s how good these vipers are.

    So lets be practical, I understand Bernard is an academic and for him to remain effectivem credibility is key, so under the circumstances, it may be wiser not to say anything.

    I will probably face disciplinary action for letting the cat out of the bag, but I am first and foremost a sportsman, so there you have it the high and the low readers.

    That’s as good as it gets.

  46. The Council of the Wise said

    The Council of the Wise:
    Greetings,

    We would like to know why the brotherhood press was not even given a cursory mention in your vidpost by either B. Leong or Kevin Lim, who claims to be a prominent video blogger and social media researcher, on the socio-political blogosphere in Singapore.

    This is a genuine request for information.

    We hope to you will revert to us soonest. Thank you.

    The Council of the brotherhood.

    Posted by The Council of the Wise | July 21, 2007 11:09 PM

    (We have posted in Singapore Angle a reproduction of this post. I hope this will satisfy the curiosity of our readers. We will wait for an answer. It is after all a legitimate and polite question, one that I sure deserves an answer.)

  47. inspir3d said

    As webmaster of the IS, let me state categorically that i have absolutely nothing to do with the production of the video by BL and Kevin Lim. I merely posted the link by request.

    The issue is between you and the 2 authors of the video to settle.

    May you have lots of fun in your interactions with them.

  48. ubergayle said

    Hi all,

    Saw the vid. Still can’t figure out, how so many people on Kevin’s side missed out on the BP. Correct me if I am wrong, but Kevin did say, it was compiled by his students. This leads me as a academic to question what was the research methodology deployed? This is obviously not a personal take, if it was then it remains BL’s prerogative to include or exclude mention of the BP, lets be fair here. Personally I like to read the BP, they write very well, I must say, but many of the characters in the BP stink! Except Harpoon.

    However that is besides the point. In this case, the vid is clearly represented as a qualitative take on the Singapore Socio/political blog scene. This means even by very basic standards of qualitative based research it requires a compilation of all the major players, lets put aside the complexity of understanding of dynamics of how these sites should and shouldnt measure up in terms of influence. My point is even by the most basic yard stick of qualitative research you cannot run away from an objective factual documentation the facts demands, lets put aside whether BL even agrees or disagrees, likes or loaths the BP. However since the researchers were only students, this could have been an innocent oversight.
    I not trying to defend Kevin, but thats always a possibility bc many of the BP readers are usually older people. However, even that oversight should have been picked up by Kevin who is presumably their supervisor, so again we are back to square one again. How did such a huge oversight occur? Even if those students are not experts in research techniques, they would have realized when deriving at focused samples to categorizes data into patterns as the primary basis reporting results, they would have spotted the brotherhood press. This people produce 3 to 4 articles a week. That’s no joke, even by professional standards. I dont even know anyone or group in Singapore blogosphere that even has such a prolific record, do you? So how they missed out on the brotherhood press is completely beyond even me and any of my friends. We were all talking abt it this morning and this will certainly be interesting to watch.

    Just to add, I did some research and FYI, the term Socio / political did not exist bfr the brotherhood press made its debut in Singapore. I noticed this term was only used as a descriptive term when they, the BP began tagging the articles they regularly produce. You can all see it for yourself, at the end of each of their articles, there is some mamba jambo abt codes and this is where they usually include the name of the writer along with the subject matter.

    So again, this oversight is so blatant that I can draw many references, but for the time being, I really dont want to get involved in this matter.

    My only hope is, this can be settled in a civilized and peaceful manner and all parties should remain cool headed.

    Sorry for taking up so much space.

  49. insider scoop said

    Ah this is definitely another round of comedy. Let me tell you all a juicy inside story. My bf plays their game, but he is on the other side and this is what he once intimated to me bc I do happen to read the bro press. I especially like darkness sappy stories so I always ask him question abt darkness etc, it’s a woman’s thing. He told me in their game, the brotherhood is definitely a super power bc they have a lot of spaceships etc and they are actually like some gloried tax collection agency, if you travel in space, you need to use their spaceships, if you mine mineral, you need to pay them tax etc. They are like NTUC one giant supermarket that serves the gaming community everything from ray guns to shoe polish. To manage all this, they do have this hilarious diplomatic space school which they are very proud of. The funny part is they all take it so seriously, there are even manuals, exams etc and its easier to become a 747 pilot than to pass those silly exams. It is not easy to be a diplomat in the brotherhood only the crème de la crème get in. OK, so I said to my bf, if that is the case, then their diplomats must be top notch, best stuff etc and all that and the game should be a really wonderfully happy playground. He said that’s the funny thing, he can’t seem to figure out, most of the communities especially the US and EU gamers in the gaming board hate them all, they see them as an occupation force and they even regularly mount rebellions against the brotherhood some of them using real money to buy fake money to pay cyber mercenaries to hammer them. So I said cannot be leh, you told me, they have this tokong class of space diplomats. Then he said yeah that’s the part he cant figure out also, every gamer knows those so called super diplomats only know one sentence, it goes like this, if you don’t do this, we will invade you. Is that clear? If it is not clear, we will invade! If you do this, we will not invade you. Clear or not? So I said to my bf, this sounds like Ah Beng road rage diplomacy to me, and he said do you want to get invaded?

    I think one reason why people like Bernard Leong of the Singapore Angle didn’t mention anything abt the bro press is precisely because of this reason – fear. They brought the same gaming culture to blogosphere and as you can all see, it doesn’t work! They just need to understand, this is blogosphere, there are no empires to be built here, all this invasion talk is just a crock of shit.

    Bye-Bye

  50. insider scoop said

    Another thing, they dont see our blogosphere like you or me, where its just a place like the void deck, where well balanced ppl talk cock.

    If you look at the way they regularly talk abt all of us and even the way they structure their thoughts, you are likely to believe, we are dealing with a bunch of looney tunes who are observing us all in some flying saucer high above, they think we are another one of their fictitious planets! Who the hell talks as if they are living in outer space, no one, except them. Do you all notice that!

    You know why dont you? They took the same people, same culture and probably the same standard operational procedures they used in gaming and just transplanted it to blogosphere, no fine tuning, nothing, just plug and play and you all wonder why they fight with everyone all the time?

  51. joe said

    This is none of my business. I dont want to get involved. All I know is this, everyday I log on to the IS, and there is something interesting to read by darkness & co.

    All I know is if BL never talk abt them, then it is like going to Paris and you say never said no never saw the Eiffel Tower. Or you go to Egypt and you say you never saw the pyramids.

    Even an Ah Beng like me with only a ITE ed will tell you something bo gham here.

    I think maybe he just bo kam buan, sorry but I am not so clever to argue in detail, all I know is if there is a really some explaining. I dont blame them from being angry, anyone will be angry, if you just treat them like they are like the 7 month ghost, that to me is not gentlemen.

    Dont hantam me. I have a right to my POV.

  52. Council of the Wise said

    To all:

    I have been in overseas for the past few days and please pardon me for the late reply.
    Tracy and The Council of the Wise:

    Thank you for your note. A few things that I want to point out:

    1. First of all, I refer Kevin as a prominent video blogger and also social media researcher. As for myself, I did not recall that I call myself an expert on internet research. (we never said that you were as you mentioned “an expert on internet research”, pls refer to our post for further clarification) I think that Loy has offered you the avenues to who the authorities are, for e.g. Tan Tarn How. (Mr Loy offered the afore mentioned information on his own accord pls verify with him and imputed that we sought such clarification which if you care to peruse our post again, we neither requested or sought such information.)
    2. The video is done in an ad-hoc manner. (I think this is the ratio decidendi of this entire case, this was what we sought to establish, ‘ad hoc’ so we can more or less dismiss it as the work of amateurs lacking in rigor or for that matter any value except what you Mr Leong mentioned as “fun” – I believe this is what we came here to establish and the matter is settled on that account – we see no reason to pursue this matter any further.) Kevin and I have done this out of interest and fun to educate young bloggers out there who are interested in the subject matter. I did specifically apologize that I may have missed out some bloggers in the after word. Forgetting to mention bloggers just reflects the author’s idiosyncrasies.
    3. This video is neither authoritative nor comprehensive to reflect the greater diversity of the blogosphere. Otherwise, the video may be mentioned in academic journals. It may be important to note that there is no one authority in the internet, specifically the blogosphere. This is not a world where there is currently a ruling group or party. Hence I am surprised by why you take this omission so seriously.
    4. Lastly, I have mentioned IS in the post. Since the Brotherhood Press is a subsidiary (subsidiary? You are seriously mistaken Mr Leong. Kindly verify with inspir3d, the webmaster of the intelligent Singaporean. He will testify to endorse this as a matter of fact i.e your assumptions are premised on erroneous facts – darkness never made such representations either impliedly or expressly to suggest the brotherhood press is a subsidiary of the IS. If you peruse our articles at the end, there is a caption which states quite clearly it is remains the solely under the purview of the brotherhood press.) under that, I don’t see why I should have made any mention at all. Perhaps the Brotherhood should consider setting your own blog (how do you define a blog Mr Leong? Are we to assume your definition of a blog is premised on a structural criterion? One which is based on the fulfillment of form rather than content and the spirit of intendment of what it is supposed to convey to the general reading public? – What you fail to register is the brotherhood press regularly produces content which is synonymous to what is typically generated by other blogs. There by stating we should set up our “own blog,” you are implying that we are not a blog, that may be true in the structural sense but it fails to recognize the broader and wider paradigm of what blog typically do, that is produce what we regularly produce i.e articles.
    That line of logic is flawed as it is base and facile, besides your corseted definition of a blog assumes it to be exhaustive, that is presumptuous as it is unimaginative. On this point we disagree under the strongest possible terms. According to your logic a book ceases to be a book if it posted on line, simply because it lacks the usage of paper? How persuasive is that line of argument when one discounts the content and instead promotes the structural and form as the basis of precedence for qualification? I wonder. This is a matter which you should do well to deliberate over.) if you want anyone (who do such introductions in the future) to mention you.
    This is my last word to your query and I see no need to indulge in something so trivial.
    Take care & best regards,
    (* That was all we wanted to establish the matter is concluded as he mentioned – “Kevin and I have done this out….fun” – I believe the council will agree this was a false alarm – there is no attempt to erase our history as such – Vollariane )
    We wish you well Mr Leong and we hope we have no inconvenienced with our line of enquiries. We thank you for entertaining us and especially appreciate your candor and reasonableness.
    The matter is closed.
    Councilor Vollariane (Representative of the Council of the Wise)
    Asdf:
    Vollariane
    Cerebus
    Memphisto
    Prometheus
    (Apex: 329002 / Primus Aldentes Prime – 3773290 / Earth 22-7-07)

  53. Sanba said

    # joe Says:

    …All I know is this, everyday I log on to the IS, and there is something interesting to read by darkness & co. All I know is if BL never talk abt them, then it is like going to Paris and you say never said no never saw the Eiffel Tower. Or you go to Egypt and you say you never saw the pyramids. Even an Ah Beng like me with only a ITE ed will tell you something bo gham here.

    Joe insults the Ah Beng! What Ah Beng with any self respect will, just because he like lulian, and even though Geylang is full of lulian, expect everyone else to die die must talk about lulian??! Cannot talk about lumbutan instead? This is seebeh bo liao!

  54. inspir3d said

    Council,

    It is good to see a peaceful resolution to the issue.

    I hope that in future, similar incidents will be handled with the sensible diplomacy you have demonstrated rather than an impulsive call to a state of war.

    The latter is good neither for the Brotherhood nor for IS.

    Have a good week ahead.

    InSp.

  55. inspir3d said

    One last thing; Unless otherwise notified I shall assume the B’hood’s absence this coming Friday as I have received no reply.

  56. C / Cerebus said

    KOHO,

    Convey to darkness and the FC boys our apologize on the matter of submitting a motion for act of war under Primus Hansard code 930 / the complaint was made by Nacramanga. He will have to face disciplinary action on the grounds of fabrication – we were given the wrong information on the grounds of erasure of our history renux 9903.

    Based on the council’s fact finding mission with Bernard Leong, I don’t even see a prima facie case for motion to move for general motion order of war! There was no ground to even move on an order of 930! Convey our deepest regrets to the site owner and all relevant parties we were given wrong information.

    A special hearing will be held in Primus in the great hall at 8834 primus time, the council wishes to apologize directly to the FC boys in person – we would however caution darkness not to use flowery language in addressing us as he is well known for his tirades when addressing the council (can we pls have this assurance from you scholarboy?).

    This matter as you mentioned in comsat 378 scholarboy rightly pointed has been politicized beyond reason and Nacramanga will be sanctioned under article 990 of the penal code – the council has imposed a fine of 49,000 Imperium Shekelians as a nominal fine, he will receive a hearing, but due to the on-going war with the Tirianians, he will maintain his post / we want him to be removed from the com in the IS forthwith.

    He has much to answer – we are a fraternity governed by laws!

    This matter is most embarrassing for all us, we have obviously made a big mistake.

    Councilor Cerebus of the skull and bones order / Council of the Wise. 2007

  57. shoestring said

    Lol. Is sounds like a parody of a recent military event that got Singapore whistling.

  58. justone singh said

    Say so la in the first place. If it was for fun sake, then it should be treated like the Phua Chu Kang or Dim Sum Dolly show. There is good and bad. Good, in the future, if anyone want to do a review of blog in Singapore, they better make it clear whether it is for fun or for something more serious. If it for fun, then it cannot be used for many things, like shooting with a bengkok gun by a cock eye soldier, sure cannot hit anything, so can only use to talk cock only. Bad, in the future, if people want to do a serious review in future, they better include the brotherhood, otherwise we have all seen what will happen. I think they dont even care if it is MSM, they will just go for the throat that is not so good. It means now if you ignore them, they will come knocking on our door till we answer it – I think, I prefer to just talk cock and not be so serious.

  59. Less Confused Now said

    Bad, in the future, if people want to do a serious review in future, they better include the brotherhood, otherwise we have all seen what will happen. I think they dont even care if it is MSM, they will just go for the throat that is not so good. It means now if you ignore them, they will come knocking on our door till we answer it…

    Reminds me of the habits of a certain powerful party group of people in the offline world.

  60. What The Heow said

    I think they dont even care if it is MSM, they will just go for the throat

    What are they waiting for? The MSM has been writing putting out articles about the blogosphere for years and they’ve not mention the b’hood so far. Isn’t it time to at least send Straits Times, New Paper and Today a diplomatic message, if not to declare war outright?

  61. jpmorgan said

    “The MSM has been writing putting out articles about the blogosphere for years and they’ve not mention the b’hood.”

    Actually, that is not true. On record the ST has never done a comprehensive on an,

    “Intro to Singapore’s Socio-Political Blogosphere.”

    I dont agree with what the bro press did with BL, I think they allowed their gaming culture to interfere with how matters are usually resolved in real life. Neither do I agree with how BL represented his intro abt Blogs in Singapore either, that is bc he never qualified himself by stating clearly it was for comic relief – say so lah, if it is for fun, but that was not how it came across to anyone who saw it. Words like “research” and “compile” were used, so what was I expected to think?

    Cut to the chase, both sides are at fault, one for failing to mention and the other for assuming the other is “erasing their history” wtf that means, I dont even know, but it seems a big deal to them.

    As it stands,I for one am still waiting for the beef = “Intro to Singapore’s Socio-Political Blogosphere.”

    Just my 2 cents

  62. jpmorgan said

    Actually, it will be quite interesting to see what will happen if newpapers do a similar write up like BL and excluded mentioning them.

    I can imagine the whole of Singapore looking out of their windows for flying saucers as if we have been invaded by aliens.

    That would really be hilarious! As it is, this matter with BL and BP has everyone I know rolling around the floor in my office in stitches – peng lai peng kee!

    This is definitely first class comic relief. I even suspect tis could be a spoof stage managed by the people who run Singapore Angle and IS!

  63. Olio said

    Comedy is the word this Monday, nice way to start the lousiest day in the week LOL

  64. Less Confused Now said

    jpmorgan

    Words like “research” and “compile” were used, so what was I expected to think?

    Good grief! Ok, let’s get technical.

    Sure the video is entitled “Introduction to Singapore’s Socio-Political Blogosphere”. But watch the next slide: “This is theorycast #26”. That tells me two things: (1) the person officially putting it together is not BL but Kevin Lim of theoryisthereason, BL is just the person being interviewed by Kevin; and (2), for heaven’s sake, it’s a vodcast–the preceding vodcast (#25) is entitled “We eat donuts all over Singapore” and has Kevin and co. literally doing just that.

    This is hardly the sort of platform where one could, by default, expect hardcore research. This is not a “Working Paper” from the Singapore Internet Research Center or an article from the Journal of Contemporary Social Science. It’s not even one of the usual boring long winded Singapore Angle or Yawning Bread articles (and I’m sure there must be articles like that from the BP, not that I’m a reader) complete with statistics, charts, endnotes, Hansard citations, bells and whistles, etc.

    In addition, watching the vodcast again, turns out that BL’s list was given partly in answer to Kevin’s question: he was asked to comment on a recent Tomorrowed post that talked about a possible decline in the Singapore socio-political blogosphere. BL’s list was given in answer to that question, to show that there are still lots of active blogs out there.

    It was here that he pointed to the spreadsheet “complied” by Kevin’s students (his *students*, goodness) and mentioned that he liked Alex of Yawning Bread because when Alex writes about an issue, he goes and “research” about it first.

    Look, if either Bernard or Kevin even *thought* that they could present any comprehensive research on the socio-political blogosphere on a short, 20min vodcast, they are insane (their PhDs have given them permanent head damaged). On the other hand, those who can actually *look* at this (no , no hearsay) and say that they are watching something that is meant to be serious research, and worse still, perceive an insult where there is none, either has no idea what hardcore social science research looks like, or just needs to take themselves less seriously.

  65. Jan said

    Boys, Girls & Aliens,

    The crux of the issue is simply this, but bfr I get pelted to dust, permit me to point out the obvious, I dont regularly read SA writes, only bc they are too academically slanted and I dont know how to say this without coming across as a witch, but they’re borning. Having said that, writes there are excellent and super, They are benched by the excellent SA team who probably check endlessly and vet to boot rubbish. The QC terribly high. So naturally, when something like a “Singapore’s Socio-Political Blogosphere” carried the SA banner. I said, alright this must be like the rest of the excellent 5 star quality material they usually vet through to ensure a minimumm level of standard. Naturally all of us expected the same degree of attention to detail which we associate with the SA banner. Look, I am not saying thats the definitive guide for bona fide regard, but we all know SA is well known for quality, quality and quality.

    But 3/4 into the vodcast and BP not mentioned! Even I was rudely surprised by pastry lighter than air! This brings me to my plank, if this vodcast was produced by Mr Brown or lets say TC, those spaceboys wouldnt have got their knickers crossed to the point of falling over themselves like a bunch of stand up comedians, that much, that much I am 100% certain. Now I hear Dr Leong and Dr Lim is telling us all it is for “fun” and musical chairs.

    I am sorry but did I miss Dumbo the jumbo elephant? Pleeeze dont flame me. Really, I am being terribly honest here, even I was rudely surprised, they didnt mention the BP and now the role reversal is enuf to give me the faints.

    Do be nice.

  66. Jan said

    I will have you all know, I happen to be not any run-of-the-mill running in lawyer, but one who specializes in International Law. There is a give away to this fiasco, a slip even, its very discreet, but its there.

    There is a part in their communique where they posted in the SA, where presumably their supermo pitbull Mr or Council dude Vollairaine uses the term, “ratio decidendi.” If you notice carefully, he is not even directing it at Dr Leong, but rather, it seems to be a slip, a sort of adjunct even hardly lay, rather the sort of coded language which only one lawyer would use when he’s trying to convey an axiom to another lawyer.

    The other give away is the line up, there are 4 of them if you notice> In legal terms, we call it a phalanx or box, it’s an attack formation usually used by legal teams in the Hague or United Nations.

    Those boys were definitely out to bat Dr Leong for six, no doubt abt it, but when they realized they didnt even have to fight to establish the causa rationale. Bc Dr Leong said, it was all done in the sake of fun. Do you all notice, it took the wind out of them completely! They probably exchanged flabbergasted looks, followed by a curt, Ahem! What are we doing here! Errh thank you very much, it has been very nice having this delightful conversation, we will see ourselves out now, bye bye.

    Definitely a faux pas.

    Very disappointing I must say I expected the usual panache, aplomb and verve that accompanies a rumble.

    They definitely stepped on it and made fools of themselves this time. Only if you know how to read between the lines that is. Only if you know like moir.

  67. pissoff said

    Well guys, if Bernard do the video, credit to him for taking the first step. I wonder why the commotion about of not including others bloggers and even bigshot. Other also can do the video and call it comprehensive as well. Internet is free and need no permission.

    You can only satisty some but not everyone. Bernard do what he needs to do.

    Instead of united for a common purpose, many are just over-sensitive, petty and fighting against one another.

    Well, if you can do better than Bernard, why not come out your own video ?

  68. pissoff said

    Look like those BigShot here is like our MenInWhite. Full of ego and full of pride.

  69. pissoff said

    If brotherhood want to be more visible and popular, then simply show their face and leave their name, then the newspaper will print their face and everyone knows them. It happen with the ONline Citizen by name of Andrew. Now everyone knew about Andrew, and that’s a good thing.

    If brotherhood want to stay behind the mask and be Robin Hood, how’s the hell people are going to be interested in ‘AlienWithNOFace’ ? Wanna put a Pokemon to represent Brotherhood ?

    Brotherhood really sound sinister. Ever heard of the “brotherhood of the wolf”

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Brotherhood_of_the_Wolf

    It really sound like a secret society.

  70. let them eat cake! said

    Dats how they regularly terrorize the underground gaming community. No one knows how many of them there are. Or even how big they even are. All we know is when we dont pay tribute, taxes or someone decides to break their monopoly on space travel, those ridicolous Gothic baby bonnet totting diplomats magically appear along with their Armada of space ships and they begin conducting what they term, “maneuvers” and “exercises” around our star system. They are usually very nice abt it, very public school spit and shine, well-mannered, polite etc. All the while behaving as if we done something so very wrong. So everyone just pays up. But it’s still very intimidating, none of us still know who they really are? Or how many of them, there are.

    If everyone can only put their differences behind. We can all unite, we can all kick them out! IMHO they just sorround themselves in this big cloud of smoke and mirrors of mystique etc. So most of the underground gamers dont even know what to make of them. Weirdo’s.

  71. pissoff said

    Brotherhood really behave like PAP of the Singapore blogosphere !
    Maybe they are really make up of PAP MIW.

  72. pissoff said

    Whoever Brotherhood are, just hope one of those members are not Mrs Peanut and William Hung ! ‘Bang’ themselves not us.

  73. pissoff said

    Jan Says:
    “The other give away is the line up, there are 4 of them if you notice> In legal terms, we call it a phalanx or box, it’s an attack formation usually used by legal teams in the Hague or United Nations.”

    Maybe Brotherhood are really fantastic four in disguise, or four Musketeers, or four horsemen of wrestling world, or four horsemen of the apocalypse http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Four_Horsemen_of_the_Apocalypse

    Whatever it is, the world is not ending without the brotherhood. Singaporean still live as happy as Shriek.

  74. Prima Delli said

    Excuse me. If they go what will be all read then?

    ST? Today? Mr Brown? See what I mean.

  75. David said

    Prima Delli,
    doesn’t really matter. We been living under FUD(fear, uncertainty, Doubt) so very long time. Singapore is larger than PAP, and anything else. We still survive without them. Even without Brotherhood, there might be others willing to fill the gap. No one is indispensable.

  76. koalabear said

    🙂

    I want to be nice to all. If I am invited to a Penang food fair. Naturally, I expect the genre of gastronomical delights one assoc with straits chinese / malay food. popiah, kueh teow, chee cheong fun, orh-chean, but do pls tell what if Asam laksa is missing from the menu?

    Is it still then a Penang food fair? Am I in a position to ask for a refund? This really is not so hard to understand not even for someone like me who has no professional training in law etc. Its common sense when you marginalize people to the extent of ignoring them as if they never existed and represented it as a means of getting “involved in Singapore’s socio-political blogosphere” and you exclude even one single mention, not even a reference, nothing, it is as bad as genocide and ethnic cleansing.

    They would have done the same even if it was the US internet research institute based in Washington DC.

    It is a valid question. Why didn’t you mention us? As it is one that relates directly to their history. Whether we think it is important or not is irrelevant. You know I was in Japan recently and this girl said, I cant Liz why you chinese get so mad abt us all the time whenever we print a new edition of history books for just kids. I was indignant! angry even that she could didnt even have the imagination to understand!

    But when I visited a place like Hiroshima, the people knew and not only understood but protested against their own govt for changing the words in their history books. They knew only bc they once lost.

    Someone once wisely said here, you have every right to have differing opinions, but no one these days has a right to be factually wrong. But what about those case when they are not even mentioned as if they never once wrote, talk to us or even existed?

    Arent you also wipping out my history as an individual? Or have I just been talking to split personality all these years?

    Respect others and they will respect you.

  77. hiroshima said

    hiroshima = brotherhood press? Are you kidding me? hiak hiak hiak….what a load of

  78. Sanba said

    koalabear

    The first part of what you said sort of make sense. But that’s assuming that the fair advertise itself as a “Penang food fair”, is a big scale affair, etc., and not some smallish operation with only a few stalls. (Otherwise, every Polish, or Greek, or Norwegian will have grounds for saying that all the “Western” food stalls in our hawker centers are trying to erase their food culture!)

    The part about the Chinese anger at the Japanese makes less sense. The Japanese did terrible things in China during WW2. The Chinese anger at the Japanese text-book writers and education establishment that sanctions them is making a fairly specific charge–the Japanese, by teaching 20th century the way they do, are essentially refusing to acknowledge that they did those terrible things to the Chinese. So what terrible thing that Bernard did to the Brotherhood in the past–at the level of the rape of Nanking terrible–is he being charged with “wiping out” now?

    The third part (about Hiroshima, etc.) makes even less sense: Bernard is not the government able to dictate some official line about “the true and authorized version of what the Singapore socio-political blogosphere” is and is to be taught in all schools primary, secondary and tertiary. Isn’t this the whole point about the blogosphere–that there is no official voice per se, that it’s the wild west where anyone can say what they want, etc.? Bernard has no ability to wipe out any history even if he had wanted to. How is he to do any such thing when putting out the contrary version, or the truth, if you will, is as simple as writing another blog post (and posting it on IS, I should add). It is entirely believable that with their readership, the BP’s version of the story will be heard by many more people than Bernard’s!

    What troubles me is not the fact that the B’hood and its supporters should take offense. They have every right to–after all, it might seem rather remiss of Bernard to not mention them (though to be fair, I don’t believe that he ever intended the vodcast to be comprehensive). What troubles me is that they should go on to react in a way that is all too familiar from how a certain powerful group often does in the offline world. Rather than just put forward their version of the story (which will, as I said, likely reach more people anyway) and let the readers judge for themselves, they “call for war”.

    Thankfully, cooler heads prevail–rather than shake one’s spears and band one’s shields, a simple, polite email or comment left at the appropriate place asking for clarification, and the resolution thereafter.

    Contrary to what you say, everyone not only have the right to have differing opinions, but also to be factually wrong. They even have the right to express factually wrong views. Freedom of thought and opinion cannot mean otherwise. No one, however, given that same freedom, has the right to everyone else agreeing with what he thinks or says. What you are saying basically implies that the B’hood not only has the right to say their piece, but that they have a right to have other people say what they want said. Even granting what they want said is TRUTH, this is still hubris, the same hubris that got people like Galileo into trouble!

    I tend to have a better estimation of the B’hood.

  79. CEO said

    Dont complicate matters. Its simple, if I someone does a fortune 400 review, I expect to see all the heavy weights there.

    If the heavy weight isnt there. I will ask why? we live in a world where no one can say black is white! You cannot blame them for asking.

    The facts are really quite clear. BP has produces regularly. I asked my sec to compile some data.

    On average they production rate is 247% times more than the average blog. Their article use 400% more words that the av blogger. Thet garner a significant No of readers although for some reason they keep playing the numbers down.

    So let us not kid ourselves, they have a big footprint in the SG scene.

    So if you tell me Mr B Leong forgot them, it is a bit like not mentioning the Great Wall of China or the Taj Mahal. No excuse whatsoever.

    Those BP sharks who confront Mr B Leong were out to destroy his reputation, let us have no doubt abt that. I have seen it bfr, even ppl like darkness have no control. But let us not fool ourselves it is not cooler heads who won here. Only when they heard the word ‘fun’ was mentioned, they just walked right out of the door bc they realized this was a light weight spouting is personal POV.

    One thing from all this is clear at least, this is SA, BL’s PERSONAL pov. You have a right to it. But like all things personal, I have a right to also chuck it into the bin.

    It would be interesting to see the ST pull a similar stunt by publishing an article and excluded them, Maybe what we will see is what happened to the Morning Post on 12th Sept 2003 in HK.

  80. CEO said

    “What troubles me is not the fact that the B’hood and its supporters should take offense.”

    You r crazy. You think we like them NO! Everyone who reads the BP hates them in one way or another bc they are really arrogant etc.

    If you dont believe me, just look thru their past. This darkness character has a history of denigrating his female readers by even calling them unmentionable names.

    He even once changed the term “journalist” to “reporter” just to chee kiat the ST journalist.

    That is why if you notice, the word journalist has been deleted from the BP.

    Zero customer service, but they write well, they really know how to write. That much I have to give. Content must be king, it must be. I dont like to admit it, but many read them, but many also dont like them.

  81. dr Y.K said

    Hello,

    I have a few points to add. All the saber rattling was childish. However, let us not allow this to distract us from the main issue. Can any reasonable person believe you can discuss about the socio-political tapestry in Singapore blogosphere without mentioning the BP? Putting aside rights to publish, to be heard and mentioned. Now I may not like the North Korean regime, I think they a defunct Stalinist state that’s destabilizes the region, but if I happen to even be a Geography buff, I still have to recognize their existence by citing the Korean peninsula along with depicting their borders etc. We all know there are varying degrees of maps, some are detailed, others can be as simple as the blown up beach ball my son plays with. However, even a simple depiction requires a simple representation. So forgive me, I fail to understand how invoking lack of comprehensiveness, fun or even ad hoc can totally absolve anyone from the obligation to be basically accurate? I put the blame squarely on SA, they should have vetted through the vodcast, the intelligent Singaporean was mentioned! However, what is the IS. Am I to believe it’s just an aggregator as the interviewee mentioned? If that is the case then why do BP articles posted here regularly represented form a mainstay? Again can any reasonable person log into the IS and fail to either notice the BP? Lets not even discuss the issue of readership. I think not. Thirdly, is the BP a blog? What really is a blog, it is hardly a term that has even has an extensive length of history. The definition is even evolving as we speak. Can anyone subscribe to the belief just because the BP do have all the traditional attributes of a blog, but yet manages to produce the same content as a blog! Is this justifiable basis not to mention them? I cannot see how that sort of reasoning holds true even by very basic primary school standards. I agree anyone has the freedom to write, say or even represent the world is a donut. You can even publish it, but will any reasonable person reading it be persuaded by your view point. I think not.

    I agree with CEO on the last point. They were out to get BL, not even Kevin or even the SA. They aimed for one target, it’s a negotiating strategy, never take on more than you can handle. Their main point to establish only one point again these are hallmarks of professionals, keep it simple. Their strategy to secure at all cost on that one count alone. – this was Jan’s theory incidentally, I agree with her analysis. These are all hallmarks of a professional hit team.

    Let us not fool ourselves, do you think, they would send their first division just to satisfy the infantile and petulant fancies of the FC boys. The FC boys are mere minions, half the time they are trading barbs with the rest of bloggers. What we don’t realize is they don’t even get along with others within the brotherhood. They produce a lot of noise only because darkness is some sort of witty showman who regularly criticizes and pokes fun at the council. So of course that emboldens the rest to lose their heads from time to time. Those of us who have followed them since icered.com have seen in the past with our own eyes how the council has warned, invaded, occupied and even dictated terms to the FC boys. FC boys write well, personally I don’t know any character in the whole of Singapore blogosphere that is as charismatic and magnetic as darkness, but let’s face it, his online persona is nothing less than obnoxious and a disgrace that seriously needs stern correction especially when it comes to his treatment of the ladies. I really have no idea why they put up with his nonsense. Even I cannot understand how someone who comes across as so well mannered, soft spoken and cultured in real life is able to be turn into a Dr Hyde online. I cannot and my wife regularly ask, is this the same delightful boy, we dined with? Let us not fool ourselves especially the long time readers, those council guys don’t get emotional about anything. They are cold, calculating and exacting hardly the type to miscalculate. If you think for one moment cooler heads prevailed. You are naïve. This could have gone very ugly. On that I am absolutely certain. Good day Sirs and Madam.

    It’s very nice to see many of the old forumers here again. I must say.

    Cheers.

    Dr Y.K

  82. pissoff said

    Well, just out of respect for any BigShot and to prevent future unhappiness and to be united against MIW’s stupid and selfish policies, whorever want to talk about political blogosphere will just have to do themselves a flavour by mentioning and referencing the following entity whoever they are:
    1. Brotherhood
    2. Sisterhood
    3. Gayhood (Gay is growing importantly somehow)
    4. mamahood
    5. papahood
    6. Robinhood
    etc

    Well, list is not yet ‘comprehensive’,

    Please tell me if I yet to miss any important hood mention.

    Whatever hood you put in, just don’t gonna ‘hood'(whack) !

  83. lady of the lake said

    “Even I cannot understand how someone who comes across as so well mannered, soft spoken and cultured in real life is able to be turn into a Dr Hyde online. I cannot and my wife regularly ask, is this the same delightful boy, we dined with?”

    Sir, I share exactly your sentiments on this issue completely and absolutely, polite to the point of being feted and wooed, yet for some inexplicable reason he seems almost a different person here. Very strange indeed, I wonder who really is the real darkness?

    All I can say is it was not fair not to mention them. This is not a matter of pride or for that matter an expectation even of recognition. From what I see they even regularly downplay their importance. For some strange reason these days we still have subject matter experts who keep insisting the likes of Mr Brown and TOC are still the premier blogs everyone reads. Obviously, they are so out of touch with reality, no one these days even listens to them not without laughing. Indeed there is merit Sir, in insisting, presuming and even assuming, but let us all be clear on a point of certainty, facts can never be discounted at the peril of those who chose to ignore them.

    May I please say only one thing, please don’t be so hard on darkness. He is so dear and even vulnerable.

  84. kokopop said

    The issue ladies & gents is simply this, is the Intelligent Singaporean merely an aggregator? That depends; what do you consider a car that is able to run on petrol and electricity?

    Obvious, we all call it a hybrid. For I might add very good and sound reasons. So to suggest for one moment the the net is divided into just blogs and aggregators is to demonstrate a complete lack of understanding for even the basic and rudimentaries.

    This is why so many of us are asking why wasn’t those monkeys mentioned? What I wonder is the mystery here?

  85. darkness said

    Good Evening,

    This matter is settled. If it for ‘fun,’ it is for ‘fun.’ If it ‘ad hoc,’ it is ‘ad hoc.’ These are not my words, I am quotating directly from source.

    Whether you want to regard what they represented of Singapore blogosphere as definitive is entirely your prerogative. I have no comment.

    All I know is, if it’s for ‘fun’ and done on an ‘ad hoc’ basis. It is for ‘fun’ and based on an ‘ad hoc’ basis. What really do you all expect me to say?

    Thank you for all your comments. It has added much to my understanding of the entire matter.

    Does the BP deserve a mention? Their position is NO. Were we even asked? I received nearly 74 e-mails on this point alone. No is the answer. Bc it was done presumably in the name of ‘fun’ and on a ‘ad hoc’ basis.

    Why were we not mentioned, bc technically, we are not a blog. Do I agree, that is immaterial again, if something is done for ‘fun’ sake and on an ‘ad hoc’ basis, then that is exactly what it is – for ‘fun’ and on an ‘ad hoc’ basis. So again I cannot even comment on whether I agree or not, only bc it for ‘fun’ and done on an ‘ad hoc’ basis. Do I agree with their definition? Immaterial, all I know is it is done for ‘fun’ and on an ‘ad hoc’ basis. So how again, how can I even comment?

    However, all of you need to consider what is the objective of this exercise? That is to say what are they trying to accomplish here? Did they do it successfully? Were all the milestones reached?

    Again my opinion is immaterial. This is something for all of you have to consider against the background of ‘fun’ and an ‘ad hoc’ exercise.

    However, allow me to be very clear.

    If there another publication to this effect and it claims to be even based partially or completely on this ‘fun’ and ‘ad hoc’ review then we will simply whip out the post com-sat between the council and Bernard Leong. Then all of us will be happily reminded once again it was all for done in the name of ‘fun’ and on an ‘ad hoc’ basis. Dont even care whether it the Herald Tribune, Aga Khan Foundation or the Idi Amin Institute of Knowledge Research based in Kampala.

    I never expected one ounce of gratitude from anyone when I started this. Not even one, many of you who were mentioned knows what are the challenges needed to sustain a blog. The balancing of work and blogging etc, the time, the effort and what could be otherwise done with the time.

    All of you who were mentioned have no idea how my men feel. Maybe that was also done for the sake of ‘fun’ and on an ‘ad hoc’ basis.

    Whatever it is, this is something to consider serious when you next decide to do something in the name of ‘fun’ and on an ‘ad hoc’ basis. So do not presume to tell us we are overacting or sensitive. I will give you a tight slap and that trust me will be definitely fun and on an ad hoc basis too.

    Or maybe even that is too taxing to imagine bc it is for ‘fun’ and based on an ‘ad hoc’ basis also.

    Inspir3d pls close this thread. I dont want to see another comment.

    We consider this discussion closed.

    We thank you all for your comments and I will certainly write on this matter very soon.

    Have a happy weekend.

    Darkness 2007

  86. darkness said

    And this goes on to Kevin Lim as well. We will take the whole blogosphere, there is nothing to lose, even if we lose everything. I realize we had nothing in this first place any way, none of you even gave us one molecule of respect, so what is there to lose, it is exactly like my relationship with my church. It is a matter of fighting to the very end, we all lose.

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